Free Trials

I would recommend all developers eliminate free trials and we would end people moving from system to system getting free signals. There are people with dead credit cards and just freeloaders abusing the system.


I struggle with this as well. Lots of people trialing Pangolin Z for a month and then unsubscribing. Like 90%. Even when it is one of the lowest monthly fees there is little commitment.

Not sure if an even lower monthly fee but no trial period would generate more revenue. This would benefit current subscribers but no guarantee that the total number of subscribers would go up to compensate.

I basically just ignore the noise and focus on making the system work as well as possible - my “Field of Dreams” approach …

There’s no struggle for me anymore. I see guys use our HARD WORK for free and then dump the system to move along to the next free lunch. There are many good systems to “use” and then move on to another account and reuse. I had one guy dumb enough to use his same name with a different email account to get another free trial. Then when it came time to ante up the credit card was bad.


So what is stopping you from removing the free trial on your systems?

I have had the same experiences, but they are infrequent and I won’t let them affect my perspective or efforts here at C2. The subscribers I do have make the up for any headaches.

Already did end all free trials.

RBgold Supra charges immediately

Kevin, I did away with free trials a week or so ago. You have a nice system it appears. But that is what I am saying. People can move from nice system to nice system with free trials. There are many systems that make money and are good solid money makers.
Why give this away??

Kevin, I certainly don’t think mature systems such as your own “need” a free trial. The track record is there. Perhaps restrict free trials to systems under X months old. I think from a developer standpoint it would be a great move to separate the wheat from the chaff.
If we could all make this move together it give us a clearer understanding on where we stand with subscribers. I for one am disappointed when a subscriber drops a system after a great month of return. The only thing that makes sense is “this guy wanted it all for free”

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I hear what you are saying. I felt the same way ay least a half dozen times over the past year. But I figure it this way - I do the same work whether there are free subscribers or not, and some of them are willing to pay if they see in the system (and the developer) something they can work with.

A lot of the trials are to see the level and frequency of trades, the way the developer communicates with subscribers, and what he/she does if things get wonky. If 1 in 10 (about my average) become paid subscribers, we both win.

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The problem as I see it is people just circulating from free trial to free trial. I’m doing my part to stop it. It’s like people have no idea what a managed futures account costs in the real world. The grid gives all the information needed to make a decent choice. Plus the whole trade history is accessable to see all the info you need.


How about this?

Collective2 knows subscribers profit/loss.

What if Collective2 will implement this optional function for developers:

“If subscrier’s profit is greater than (5 x subscriber fees) send an e-mail to the subscriber”:

"Dear subscriber, your current profit generated by my trading system is greater than (5 x subscribe fees) now.

Please consider to pay subscribe fees.

Your trial period will terminate prematurely if your profit will reach the value (7 x subscribe fees)."


I am a paying subscriber to several systems

You should reward your subscribers no free trial but a reduction in monthly price after a certain subscription period

One could go further - make the first month a nominal chrage (say $10) and then base the monthly fee on a set percentage of the prior month’s performance. One could make all accounts the same size (say $25000) and for every $250 (1%) you gain each month you can charge $25. A losing month means no payment for the next period (we already have this option).

This would normalize system costs in that every system subscription would be based on the same pay-for-performance model. Only the best performing systems would make real money, and that’s only becuse they are making 10x that for their subscribers.

The free trial is a carrot and stick. Here’s the customer thinking: "Wow this systen looks great, but does it really make money? It’s got a free trial. I’ll try it. If it makes the subscription cost I’ll continue, if not, losses minimized.

A five day trial is meaningless. With gen 3 there are no trading glitches. The performance is there to see along with real fills.


I see you are auto trading three systems. How does that work? Isn’t that the equivalent of a free trial?

To understand why I think the free trial as it is right now does more good than harm for us developers, I look at my own stats (which I will share here).

Since 1/2/2014 I have had 89 people sign up for the free one month trial - this is a lot by C2 standards, and I think most system developers here would agree. Of those, 45 stopped without becoming a paid subscriber, 28 are still in the trial phase, and 16 either paid something before stopping or are still subscribing.

I think that without the free trial I would not have this many folks who paid for (and hopefully got worth from) the system. Like I said before, it is no more work for me if there are 2 subscribers or 200.

Maybe I’m not complaining about the free trials because I have a decent number of long-term subscribers? Probably, but I wouldn’t have them if I had decided not to have a free trial.

Bottom line, free trial or no free trial, if you have a good track record with a small drawdown people will subscribe. If you have a 5%+ drawdown the subscribers will leave.


Free trials in my experience have been a sham. During a time when I featured my system with a free trial in place, a few people signed on and although had they taken the signals during that time at the level I suggested they would had made $2000 to $4000 a week and even though that system has gone to make consistent money in a steady fashion, they all dropped at the end of the trial period and never returned. So I got rid of the free trial and dropped my fee to almost nothing – $9.99 a week only if profitable. Now no one even takes a look.

Part of the problem is the average C2 subscriber trades like every other person who loses money. They enter at the height of a system when it is hot and then pulls the plug at every draw down…rinse and repeat. And along with the draw down writes a horrible review of a system that has performed well for years. But yet couldn’t say one good word about a system when they were making money. Look at the reviews of WSS Gold 100oz if you want a perfect example.