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What is the URL to the current list of Gen3-compatible brokers available to new USA subscribers? As an ETF system publisher, I need to keep abreast of this, to suggest appropriate brokers.
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Is Gen3 still the latest version of C2 autotrade software? And is current fee of the latest C2 software still about $800 on an annual basis?
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Since the merger of Trade Monster with Options House–which one is now listed for new Gen3 subscribers–or neither?
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Currently (May 2015) when I click the “Broker Wizard” tab, I am only asked to open an account at Interactive Brokers. Why is this? (IB is now the only C2-compatible broker for new subscribers?? Or C2 just wants to get commissions by signing everyone to IB regardless of whether or not IB is used for C2 trading??)
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For USA residents–is Interactive Brokers compatible with Gen3 for stocks & ETFs? (Answer was NO the last time I checked.)
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For USA residents–is MB Trading compatible with Gen3 for stocks & ETFs?
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For USA residents–are there any other Gen3-compatible brokers with a per-trade fee of $5 or less? (Otherwise the trading overhead will be too high for my ETF systems for subscribers investing less than $100,000 per system.)
Okay, lots of good questions. Here are the answers:
https://www.collective2.com/about-autotrade#brokerTableAnchor
The term “Gen3” - a very unfortunate choice of service name, I sheepishly admit, since it suggests a version number, which it wasn’t meant to be – is the latest and greatest C2 AutoTrade technology. It means that all the AutoTrading stuff is “server-based” – that is, it runs “in the sky.” You don’t need to run any software on your own computer. In fact, you don’t even need to keep your PC turned on. Just set up you trading preferences here on the Collective2 web site, including which C2 strategies you want to follow, how large to make the trades, etc. – and everything happens magically in your broker account, even if you turn off your home computer.
As far as pricing goes, you have two choices:
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If you only trade futures and/or forex, you can pay on a per-trade basis for futures and forex trades. The fees are $1.99 and $0.50 respectively.
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You can pay a flat fee of $99 per month, for all instruments, including futures, forex, stocks,
options.
In both cases, you still pay your regular brokerage commissions, whatever they are, depending on your broker and the arrangements you have with them.
Yes, the merged company, OptionsHouse, is a C2-compatible broker, and you can certainly choose to use them, as the Broker List above indicates.
We’re nudging people toward Interactive Brokers (IB) because of the simplicity of the flat-fee AutoTrade pricing we can offer there, which in turn is due to the all-inclusive nature of their offering. (You can trade all instruments through one single IB account, and you can use an IB account you already have set up elsewhere, and you only need to sign one simple set of paperwork – not different paperwork for each instrument class). This makes our job at C2 easier – less complication, easier set up, less customer service required, happier C2 Members, etc. (For what it’s worth: we don’t earn any per-trade commissions through IB if you choose the flat-fee pricing model.)
Yes! Most definitely yes. You can AutoTrade trade ANY instruments in ANY Interactive Brokers account using C2.
Yes.
I don’t know what commissions individual brokerage companies charge. I do know that C2 works with several good brokers, all of them known for competitive pricing. As for C2 AutoTrading costs, we never charge a per-trade fee for stocks, options, or ETFs. We only charge a flat monthly fee to allow AutoTrading of those instruments if you choose to AutoTrade them.
Matthew
Thank you MatthewKlein for the prompt replies.
Additional clarifications please:
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Is Gen3 still available for stock & ETF systems for $399 per 6 months = $800 / year for new subscribers? (MatthewKlein seems to say that the minimum Gen3 flat-fee is $99 per month = $1,200 / year. However I am paying $800 / year.)
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Is Collective2 considering any possibility of enabling TOS publishers of stock & ETF systems–who do not trade any other Collective2 systems–to qualify for a TOS badge without paying 4 times the price for publishing?
Otherwise I probably must discontinue TOS. Because for TOS, I must pay every 6 months: $120 publishing fee + $400 Gen3 fee = $540 total. This is more than 4 times the price for non-TOS publishing.
I understand that Gen3 enables me to trade other systems. However I do not have extra money to risk. Therefore I must pay $800 annually ONLY to qualify for the TOS badge. Obviously, I do not need Gen3 to trade my own system!
Also, please note that if you want Collective2 to attract quality systems–you cannot expect good people to “Trade Own System” unless they believe in the system and are realistic people. Therefore, you should expect that anyone who does TOS should want to keep overhead below 3%.
$800 = 10% of $8,000 = 3.2% of $25,000. Therefore, after adding broker fees, I must expect the TOS badge to cause a total overhead of about 3% of $50,000. I.e. to maintain the TOS badge–I must be prepared to maintain $50,000 in each system–or else I am crippling my personal investment potential just to get the TOS badge.
Therefore, I do suggest that if Collective2 wants to feature good TOS systems, then perhaps Collective2 should enable TOS publishers to use Gen3 for their own systems without the software fee. Because in such cases we have no use for the Gen3 software and are just being forced to pay for it.
I totally agree with your reasoning, but totally disagree with your conclusions. What I would like to see at C2 (while knowing full well this will never happen) is an offer of industry-standard NAV reporting, supervised by a CPA, with TOS audit built into the process along with performance verification. There’s no reason this should cost more than 0.1% of assets per annum, subject to a minimum fee of $1,000 per month. This way, C2 would have a shot at attracting proprietary traders who trade accounts of $10 million and more via Goldman Sachs or some other kind of Morgan Stanley…
