Dear Igor
We wish you all the best in your endevours converting 10k into 1mm
In our humble opinion trading is about a rule based systematic system.
Trying to take the sprint 10k to 1mm could only quickly lead to bankrupcy but possibly we are wrong
Trade safe, all the best,
The RuleTradingSystems Team[LINKSYSTEM_66710242]
Interesting forum to say the least. Some really good things being discussed here. More of the same would only be good for all.
I started my first signal here on C2 in 2006. I have been a steady signal broadcaster since then. I have had a few good signals that attracted clients and several that did not.
Let me add a little different outlook on signal vending here on C2. I publish these signals for a couple of good reasons. First and foremost to track a trading idea in real time with statistics provided me by C2. I feel $98.00 is not a bad fee for an education and lesson learned that may be worth millions.
When I was successful vending signals Conservative Growth and SMA I learned much from my clients. It took a couple of years and several people telling me they could not trade my short signals because they only trade in an IRA. Finally I started publishing signals using inverse ETFâs. Soon I took a closer look at my taxes and realized this was great wisdom. I am now a firm believer in the fact you cannot trade in a taxable trading account and win. The government just takes too much.
Some of my signals have been for portfolio tracking and some of them have been for my own research. My current published signals are a great example of each. I trade RPH in my 401 using 60% of my account balance. I came out with my newest signal RPH2 as a research project. It is calculated differently than RPH however very similar. Eventually I will either continue to broadcast both signals. RPH because I am trading it with my 401 and if RPH2 stands up to the task I will use it in my IRA, There is a very good possibility I will combine the 2. Discontinue them both and come out with the combined signal.
I have leaned much from broadcasting on C2. In 6 years I have evolved from a very small signal broadcaster wanting to earn money vending signals to a much bigger fish just wanting to learn trading.
Finally I would like to bring up an important point. Successful trading is not about keeping your eye on the end game. It is about the steps you are taking along the way. If you are trading to make yourself rich you are here for the wrong reasons and your motives will likely create a methodology that will trip you up and do exactly the opposite of what you intend. Trading is about self discipline and personal growth. Since trading is extremely difficult to do correctly if you donât focus on what it is to be a good trader your focus will not be beneficial and you will most likely lose. To be a successful trader one must have an iron clad sense of self and determination that cannot be shook. Trading can be the most powerful personal growth tool you will ever engage in, or it can limit you financially and cause you great distress. It is all centered on focus and intent.
Focus on trading correctly and intend on being the best trader you can be. The money will come flowing to you thru the back door.
Thatâs all I have got to say bout that.
Rick Haines
Hello again,
Believe it or not, some systems developers here on C2 managed to generate tremendous profits for their subscribers, with only a modest starting capital.
Look at this system for example, the vendor turned a mere $28,052 into $2.7 MILLIONS dollars in less than 4 years, see for yourself: http://collective2.com/cgi-perl/system35893350
Yes, you read correctly, that’s 2.7 MILLIONS profit in less than 4 years.
And what is even more amazing is that the starting capital ($28,052) was preserved the whole time, which is quite a feat!
(Yes, the maximum drawdown exceeded 80%, but the “losses” came from the profits, not from the initital capital itself)
Would I trade such system? Probably not (too late now, the system is playing with the house’s money already and can afford large “drawdowns”), but it just shows that making millions on C2 is not only possible, but has been already been achieved, as you can clearly see in this one example alone.
Happy trading and have a good weekend.
A great example of why when evaluating signals one should look at the reviews posted by traders of the signal.
Rick
Mr Haines, the fact remains that if you had 30k to invest in the system shown above, you would have close to 3 million good old American dollars sitting in your bank account right now, regardless of any C2 review.
And please look again at the equity curve, your initial 30K ($28,052 to be exact) was never at risk at any time.
All these comments on how to find the system that will yield the best results are fascinating, however, we seem to have drifted a wee bit away from the original question:
How to attract more members to the C2 website?
I will return to that in a moment. But as I read Igor’s comments a thought struck me, successful roulette playing would be a wonderful system. At a 35 to 1 payout (at the highest payout bets) you only need to hit it twice to take your 28k to a little over 3.4 million.
Now Igor and quite a few C2 members will surely be quick to point out the many flaws in the proposal above. The more religious might complain it is gambling. The risk averse crowd might point out there is a very low chance of actually wining, and if you miss the bet you loose everything. The more mathematically inclined might point out that a 35 to 1 payout, with a mere 1 in 37 chances to win, actually yields a negative value for the bet, which means that over time you will loose money. Common folks might just remind me that in Vegas the house always wins (plus I am pretty sure that if the system won more than two times in a row, the developer might find his kneecaps busted).
Then someone will bring out the coin flipping gorillas (for those who might not be familiar, simple probability means that if 1,000 gorillas were to flip a coin 10 times, 1 of the gorillas would be able to get his coin to flip heads every time). C2 tells us that 19,000 systems have been started through the last roughly 10 years. So we should have at least 19 systems that have gotten it right every time, just through sheer numbers.
I do not mean to play down what Shadow Banker has achieved. Maybe (to miss-quote Joe Pesci) the laws of physics work differently in his kitchen. But when I get back to the question of how to attract more members to C2, focusing on those who want to play roulette does not seem like the most satisfactory option, or at least there should be a simpler way to highlight other options.
This post is already to long, but in my opinion the Grid favors coin tossing gorillas, and makes it difficult, rather than easy, to spot and select good systems that use a different approach to investing.
Feel free to disagree, but consider how much attention was centered around a system called Direxion TNA/TZA (or something similar) back in Oct-Nov 2011. The developer was very aggressive in the forums, and to be honest the system was going up like a rocket. The fact he had already crashed and burned about 30 systems did not stop his system from dominating the Dashboard as the most looked at system (and did not stop me from toying with the idea of catching a ride and making a ton of money). Fast forward a year and his systems are gone, although I am sure we will hear from Pal again in the future.
I think long term, many potential subscribers (myself included) would benefit from some type of tool that did not focus mainly on outsized returns, but rather on solid, consistent returns. And if enough people start making good returns by investing in C2, I am pretty certain that the members will come.
Happy end of the Olympics to all,
Dear R B
We couldn’t agree more with your thorough explanation, feel free to visit our system and webpage, we are always open to grow and learn through idea exchange, if your are interested we are always available via e-mail or skype
Regards,
The RuleTradingSystems Team
[LINKSYSTEM_66710242]
There are really only two critical factors in attracting more users: increasing awareness and access. Increasing awareness comes from advertising and positive press coverage. I have seen occasional banner ads for Collective2 (although they are typically cryptic, something along the lines of getting rid of humans), but that’s probably because I already visit C2 and its competitors sites. I see almost no press coverage of C2. I see C2’s competitors covered all the time in Barron’s, Fortune, Forbes, WSJ, etc. when discussing the next generation of investing advice, so I’m not sure what they’re doing that C2 is not to get such coverage.
The second critical factor is to increase access. Remember Willie Sutton’s axiom about robbing banks. Until C2 has Gen3 relationships (and I mean trading stocks, which is what the vast majority of retail investors trade) with TD Ameritrade, Schwab, E-Trade, Interactive Brokers, etc., it will never be more than a niche player. In the three years since I’ve discovered C2, not much has happened in that regard (except OptionsXpress has gone away), so I am going to assume that the brokers want to have nothing to do with C2. Sorry, but OpenECry and MB Trading as the only Gen3 stock trading options are not going to move the needle. There might be a more esoteric option in terms of having registered investment advisors take some role as an intermediary to bridge between C2 and the brokers (much as BulldogFX does for futures on Interactive Brokers), but I don’t know how that would work in a regulatory or technological sense.
Matthew Klein is a smart guy, so I’m sure he’s already thought of all of this and done what he can. After all, more users benefits him the most (more subscription revenue, more autotrade license fees, more vendor listing fees). I think what we have is what we are going to have for the foreseeable future.
Hi there,
I will come back to your roulette comments later, for now let’s answer this question : how do we attract more people to C2, and more importantly, to our own C2 trading system(s)?
The answer is quite simple : we need to advertise. Here are some suggestions…
1: The easiest and cheapest way is to hit every trading forum you can find and answer some questions or start a new thread, and then put your C2 link in your “signature”. If you participate regularly more and more people will start clicking on your link.
2: Advertise your C2 link on Google, Bing or Yahoo via their pay-per-click program, using keywords like “forex trading system” or “free trading signals” (assuming you offer free trafing signals for a week or a month), this will attract highly targeted people to your C2 website.
3: Advertise off-line. Start with your local newspaper with ads like this : “Attention traders! Free accurate and profitable trading signals. 20% yearly return since inception. Visit : www.MySystem…” You can also advertise in the trade magazines and newspapers (classifieds or display ads) like Investor’s Business Daily, Stocks and Commodities magazines, Futures, Barron’s, etc.
4: Have deep pockets? Then buy full-page ads in the Wall Street Journal, you will attract tons of prospects (and Matthew will be thrilled :-)) !
5: Finally, make good money for your subscribers (while maintaining a reasonable drawdown) and the rest will take care of itself.
Take care for now, I have to watch my Forex platform, my system spotted a few potential trades already…
@ R B
"And I still think that C2 should have some type of screen beyond the grid to really compare systems apples to apples. Comparing a super leveraged high frequency forex or futures system with a discretionary stock system using only stats gives an incomplete picture. "
When using grid, just enter your filter parameters and select only one asset class (stocks, futures, currencies). That way you’ll compare apples to apples.
[LINKSYSTEM_61470460]
